Dear Anon-O-Box,
I’m a female and I’m really picky when it comes to guys’ profiles. So many of them need your advice badly.
But I wonder if the same is true the other way around. I don’t look at woman’s websites, but do men respond more to the picture than to what is written in the “about me” section?
Would an attractive girl still get a lot of hits and interest if she committed the crimes you state on your site? It would be an interesting experiment, I think.
Curious Cathy
e answers:
Dear Cathy,
It seems you have a few questions here, so don’t mind me divvying this post up into the various topics. You’re lucky that I have a pretty huge insight into the male mind since a vast majority of our clients are male.
Are Girls’ Profiles Just As Bad?
Yes, yes, and hell yes. I read a lot of women’s profiles as I’m working with our male clients and I can tell you, they’re just as bad, if not worse than the men.
Women are more prone to wear their ex on their sleeve. After reading a woman’s profile, I can often tell you why their last relationship ended. Sometimes in uncanny detail. I’ve been accused of being psychic (or a witch!), but really, it’s just reading between the lines. Sometimes it’s not even that hard.
Women wave their red flags proudly, thinking they’ll drive the wrong men away. “No cheaters! No college dropouts! No liars! I want a man who knows how to treat a woman like a WOMAN!” Rawr!
Women make all the same mistakes. Every mistake guys make in their profiles, women do too. Mars and Venus aren’t so different in the end.
Do Men Respond To Pictures Or Profiles?
That wholly depends on the guy. While men are visual creatures and will judge a book by its cover, you can’t paint the entire gender with one brush. Allow me to introduce you – anonymously, of course – to a few of our former clients.
“Alfonzo” was a flavor of the week type guy. One week, he wanted help writing 10 different blondes. The next week it was 10 different brunettes. The next week it was 10 Asian girls. There was nothing in their profiles beyond their age range that these girls had in common, which lead us to believe he was going more for style than substance. We see VERY FEW guys like Alfonzo.
“Bertram” definitely had a type: he loved very dark haired brunettes, preferably with glasses. But beyond that, he pored over every profile and wanted to make she was the right brunette. There were plenty of hotties that he turned down because something in their profile didn’t ring right. Bertrams are more common than Alfonzos.
“Chester” is our typical client. He might have a type that sways some of his choices, but he’s open-minded about other types of women. He reads profiles and writes thoughtful first contact emails (after we give him some pointers!).
Chester complains to us when there’s a cute girl who doesn’t say much about herself in her profile. On the one hand, he’d like to write her. On the other hand, what if she’s not his type and he leads her to think he’s interested?
He worries about hurting your feelings. He worries about impressing you. He worries you won’t write back, even if it’s just to say no thanks. He’s really looking for the right girl – on the outside and inside.
It breaks my heart when good guys get totally ignored by girls who are “too busy” to write a quick “No Thanks” email. But that’s a story for another post entirely.
Would a “Criminal” Girl Profile With a Hot Picture Get Dates?
One word answer: Yes.
She would get dates, but they would be guys like Alfonzo, who are interested in girls mainly for their looks. She might get a Bertram or two if he could get over her profile. Some Bertrams will, others won’t. The Chesters of the world would pick up the vibe that she’s more trouble than the good looks are worth.
There’s a chance she’d get lucky and find a guy who is compatible in the long haul, but the chances are much better if she invests a little time and energy making her profile as attractive as her photos.
Happy dating, geek friends!
About Anon-O-Box
It’s harder for women to qualify their profiles because of the way online dating works. Men predominantly seek women, and women are predominantly sought. A girl with a sub-par profile will still get messages from guys, and unless she really drops the ball she’ll find that those guys aren’t especially picky about the message/email exchange – the guy has read her profile and decided that he wants to meet her.
Guys on the other hand constantly kick themselves over their methods and profiles. They send out hundreds of messages and get one or two leads who seem to like them, but a week later realize that it’s going nowhere. I know a guy whose conversion rate from message to date was less than 1:100. And he was a great guy.
I feel guilty plugging myself, but my most recent blog post talks about “inner beauty” in a tangible sense. Think of ways to demonstrate TANGIBLE inner beauty rather than just saying “I’m a cool person.” Stop thinking about filtering and start selling to the right people – because right now the best guys are reading “You CAN’T be this and CAN’T be that and I’m looking for THIS guy” and skipping you for the girl who says “I’m a student who works two jobs so that I’ll come out of it without debt. I also spend a lot of time with my family, enjoy nature and playing sports, and what I’m really looking for is someone who feels like partaking in my already happy life.”
PS: I love women who seek to improve themselves, so kudos to the OP.
I ran across my favorite “red flag” today: “Must not kick puppies and kittens.”
I suppose I’d be a Chester, then. I have an idea of the kind of girl I want* but I’m open to other kinds and variations on the theme. Every now and again I’ll send a message to a woman who’s just bizarre or my diametric opposite in some way, out of curiosity.
I am totally with you, E, on the ex thing. I used to have the same issue myself, and I’ve worked hard to eliminate it from my profile. I’d also like to add that talking about your ex tends to imply that you were the problem.
For example, “What I’m looking for: faithful, understanding, NO DRAMA!!!11one one” First, the people who complain loudest about Teh Drama are usually the cause thereof. Second, by announcing it in such a way you make me wonder what you did to drive him to whatever HE did. It’s probably not fair, but it’s true. When you say you want a fellow who’s faithful and drama-free, it makes me picture a shrieking harridan that stirs up something to complain about and ultimately drives the fellow out of the house to get away from it. Not exactly a good impression, starting out.
Third, and finally, you shouldn’t have to say ANY of this. I think we all understand that when you get into a relationship, you’re expected to care for and about your partner, practice monogamy, and generally try not to be a complete jerk. There are men (and women) out there who violate this, of course, and others with whom we just don’t get along. But I’d say 90% of the people checking your profile generally understand that, if you start a relationship, you’re expected to not sleep with other people. Especially not the entire 2008 starting lineup of the Dallas Cowboys (or Dallas Cowboys Cheerleader Squad, as you please).
Reminding us of all that makes us think you have little regard for our intelligence. This is also not a good impression to leave.
So, yeah. Describe your ex when we ask pleasantly over coffee one morning, don’t describe him in your OKCupid profile.
*pale-skinned brunette, vociferous reader, tongue sharp enough to cut steel, sense of humor, good heart and ideals higher than Everest, sense of adventure, mischievous smirk, glasses, long skirts, and army boots. If you actually walk into my life, I’ll melt into a puddle, write you love sonnets that don’t suck, and take you tromping through Bolivia to smuggle consumer electronics into Brazil.
One thing that bothers me on women’s profiles is when they declare their love for a sports team. I suppose they are trying to appeal to guy’s interests, but I read this as “wow, this is one of the most interesting things you have to say about yourself”.
Also I have received winks from girls who are cute but have bad profiles. I didn’t respond.
@Jordan – I’m wondering who would actually ADMIT to being a puppy or kitten kicker.
@Roscoe – Love your “type”
I’ve been known to wear long skirts and Doc Marten boots on occasion.
@Aaron – Yeah, I think that’s usually a way of reaching out and proving they’re not all girly. There are plenty of girls out there who love sports, tho. My friend Darya over at SummerTomato is a crazy basketball fiend, but there are plenty of other awesome things about her too. (Sorry guys, she’s taken.)
Now you’re just trying to make me swoon. ;P
Another common girl profile thing that is a red flag (to me) are references to smiling. Not that I don’t LIKE smiles, smiling, and anything principally smile related- it’s just that smiling is… you know… an automatic response…
Men get a lot of pressure growing up to be strong and decisive (and men of my generation also got a lot of contradictory pressure to be emotional and accommodating- but not too much). Based on the number of mentions of how frequently a woman smiles, combined with maniacally fake smiling photographs, I can only infer that women grow up amongst smile nazis who deprive them of supper if they fail to present the impression of being adequately sunny.
I’m sure men do it too- but MANY women’s profiles just say “I’m so obsessed with presenting the right appearance that it will take you forever to figure out who I really am. And even then, you might not be sure.”
My general experience is that I’ll usually entertain the notion of emailing an attractive woman who doesn’t really write anything for a minute, before eventually realizing that writing “Do you like stuff?” is terrible and “I think you’re physically attractive” is a weird thing to say in an introductory email. Thus, they don’t have anything to say, I don’t have anything to say.
That being said, a really GREAT profile (that’s short, oh God, just two meaty paragraphs is all that’s required…) for a woman I find moderately attractive will usually get me writing, so having something to say is extremely important. Something beyond the “I can get dressed up to go out, but I can also wear sweats and stay home. I like to drink fancy cocktails, but I’m fine with a Bud too!” The “contradiction = complex and deep” fallacy profile is my least favorite in the world. It’s like, I get it. You’re a person, and as such, are able to adapt to different social situations. But I digress…
“Women wave their red flags proudly, thinking they’ll drive the wrong men away. “No cheaters! No college dropouts! No liars! I want a man who knows how to treat a woman like a WOMAN!” Rawr!”
AMEN SISTER!
I can’t belive how many Womens profiles have content like the above. Do they honestly think this will stop these sorts of men from writing them. It’s like Bank with a sign “No Bank Robbers allowed, STAY OUT!”
I do have to say thank you again for all your great articles on your site. And profile advice you’ve given me. It’s really changed how I look at profiles online.